Jose Medellin is a convicted rapist. Jose Medellin is a convicted murderer. Fourteen years ago he was sentenced to death for participating in the gang rape and murder of Elizabeth Pena, 16 and Jennifer Ertman who was 14. His execution by lethal injection is set for August 5, 2008. The girls had tragically wandered upon a gang initiation. This would seem to be just one more routine execution of which Texas leads the nation. It would also seem that if anyone deserved to be executed, Mr. Medellin should certainly have that place in death penalty lore. There is one minor twist. Mr. Medellin is a Mexican citizen. He was allegedly denied access to the Mexican consulate after his arrest which is a violation of the Vienna Convention. Mr. Medellin was allegedly never told he had the right to see a Mexican consular officer as required by the Convention. The Vienna Convention is an international treaty governing in part the treatment of citizens of different nations outside of their home countries. The United States is a signatory to this treaty.
In a ironic diplomatic and political twist, the normally pro-capital punishment Bush administration is fighting tooth and nail to save the life of Mr. Medellin. The administration claims there a bigger picture at stake. The picture frame encompasses the rights of United States citizens who may find themselves in similar situations in Mexico and other foreign nations. It is the position of the United States that this matter is governed by the Vienna Convention and that an international court should review Mr. Medellin’s situation before any further action is taken. President Bush tried to resolve the issue three years ago by ordering all states to review the cases of 51 Mexican nationals on death row, including Mr. Medellin, as directed by the International Court pursuant to the Vienna Convention. The U.S. Supreme Court ruled earlier this year that Mr. Bush overstepped his authority and that individual states are not bound by international law on this issue. They held that this particular treaty is not “self-executing”. It also found that in the alternative Congress had not enacted any legislation enacting it. The state of Texas is therefore free to proceed with the execution.
The state of Texas could care less about what the International Court has to say about Mr. Medellin’s rights. Texas has taken the position that Mr. Medellin received fair trial in accordance with state law and any international issues are not its concern. Should the state of Texas care about the bigger picture of international politics, diplomacy and the fair treatment of American’s abroad? There is nothing in the United States Constitution requiring the states of Texas to stand down to the Vienna Convention or practice international diplomacy. This is a states rights issue. Mr. Medellin received the full spectrum of Constitutional rights he was entitled to under state law and Supreme Court rulings extending federal law to his situation. Even assuming he had some state right to consular access, how would this have affected his trial? There was no prejudice.
The Bush administration which is always death penalty friendly has to be choking on its position. It wants Texas to put aside sovereign state rights and consider the bigger picture of international diplomacy. This is a very strange bedfellow with a state’s right to impose and carry out the death penalty. A penalty that is not in conflict with either state or federal law. Does the state of Texas have any obligation to look beyond this? Should not the obligation to enforce its own laws and protect its citizenry take precedence? In the absence of any federal statute conferring jurisdiction over this matter, it would appear that the federal government should butt out and Mr Medellin be executed as scheduled.
The death penalty however must also not be inflicted in an arbitrary manner. The Supreme Court said so in Furman v. Georgia. Does the fact that Texas can choose to execute Mr. Medina and then choose to honor international law sparing the next killer’s life make this an arbitrary imposition of death?
When should a state practice international diplomacy and respect the rule of international law? The answer appears to be one of self serving agendas and political pressure. State diplomacy wins the day here. There is no upside to any upcoming election from the Governor on down if Texas sides with the federal government. The overwhelming majority of Texans want Mr. Medellin executed as quickly as possible. If the state of Texas was concerned about its international reputation would it still be executing Mr. Medellian? What if Mexico was concurrently holding a Texas citizen under sentence of death? What if that citizen has been denied international treaty rights? Would Texas then be eager to execute Mr. Medellin? If Texas has no legal obligation to stop the execution, politics and public perception agendas are all that remain. At this time, Mexico appears to have nothing that Texas wants that would justify “mercy by agenda” Let us hope we have something that Mexico wants when the roles are reversed.
July 28th, 2008 at 7:14 pm
Just to clarify, Jose Medellin was never denied access to the Mexican consulate after his arrest. He never requested the consulate’s representation, nor did his attorneys for a full year after his arrest, nor did a judge during his trial. It was not until nearly six years after his conviction that anti-death penalty advocates claimed Medellin was “denied access.”
Since Medellin had spent well over more than half his life in the United States, spoke perfect English, and was at one time an excellent student in Houston schools, police did not assume he was a Mexican. Had his parents simply handled his paperwork properly, like they did when they migrated, Medellin would have been an official American citizen.
Just want to make sure everyone knows the reality about Medellin’s Mexican national status.
Corey Mitchell
Author of “Pure Murder” about the murders of Jennifer Ertman and Elizabeth Pena.
July 28th, 2008 at 8:44 pm
ok, how about we castrate him and deport him?
p.s. twitthis – FAIL
July 28th, 2008 at 9:26 pm
Citizen or not, he is a rapist and a murderer….execute! It is one less murderer and rapist to worry about! Elizabeth and Jennifer got denied their rights the day they were murdered. We seriously need a tighter boarder. Just my opinion…
July 28th, 2008 at 10:23 pm
A treaty is a treaty. It doesn’t require a law license to understand the very simple supremacy clause found in our constitution. “This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States …and all Treaties made…shall be the supreme Law of the land…every State shall be bound…”. All this talk of “activist judges” is very silly when the most conservative members of the Supreme Court interpret this clause to mean that not all treaties are the supreme law.
While this guy doesn’t deserve much sympathy, the issue is bigger than him. What if anything does the Constitution mean? What, if anything, do treaties mean? If the Supreme Court’s flawed logic is applied in other countries, we could see Mexican states deny important treaty and convention rights to prisoners from the U.S….including Texans.
I’m a dyed-in-the-wool Democrat, but I am with George Bush on this one. State rights are subordinate to treaty obligations. Period.
July 29th, 2008 at 12:00 am
Tough decision but jose medellin needs to face the consequences of his actions. meaning since he committed a horrible crime in America he needs to face the wrath of such actions.
Tishs last blog post..The Case Of Jose Medellin
July 29th, 2008 at 1:25 am
Don’t give me that treaty nonsense. This man took the life of two innocent young girls….or did you guys miss the brutal and I mean brutal details of what he participated? Sloppy? Virgin Blood? Where were the f’in rights of the girls in questions? Did they get a fair trial or the advice of the consulate when their lives where brutally taken. I am not in any way a pro-death advocate being a liberal and lawyer and all of that, but I am COMPLETELY DISGUSTED in this case. There is only one other case around today (the Florida man who executed with a gun in the head of a 3 and 7 year old after brutally raping the mother and leaving her for dead). What these young men did, they do not only deserve not to be in society, they are what the death penalty was made for. Particularly heinous in scope, with extreme pain and suffering to the victims. I do not care how you couch this issue, these perps are disgusting and immoral beyond comprehension. I hope when Medellin meets his maker, his suffers the same fate and worse. This is not a case of bad decision making, this is a case of depravity of the absolute worse kind. There are no mitigating factors here. How many years was Medellin and his in kind younger brother living here? They were probably more Americano that natives and then to try to use that as an excuse is SICKENING!!! Even looking at his photos gives me the cold sweats. This man is pure evil. I hope Satan pitchforks him until the end of days. Where were the treaties and protections under the 5th and 14th Amendments to Pena and Ertman? They were judged, juried and executed by this immoral evil gang. My sympathay factor is excactly ZERO! To the Ertman and Pena families, I hope Medillin’s execution goes off in August and you find some peace in your lives. I could not imagine what torture and emotional pain you have been going through. My prayers are with you every single day.
July 29th, 2008 at 3:51 am
If we are going to have a Death Penalty in Texas I can think of no one more deserving of it.
July 29th, 2008 at 4:53 am
A short drop an a quick stop. Deserves no better. He got his day in court, has been found guilty just like any other American would have. Last I checked only diplomats can rape women and get away with it.
July 29th, 2008 at 6:47 pm
“There is one minor twist. Mr. Medellin is a Mexican citizen. He was allegedly denied access to the Mexican consulate after his arrest which is a violation of the Vienna Convention.”
Ohhhh, now I understand……
because of that, the girls are obviously less dead!!
July 30th, 2008 at 1:46 pm
I can’t believe that in the 21′st century that the death penalty is imposed in some US states. The number of innocent people executed, only to be exhonorated posthumously is enormous. The Guildford Four and The Birmingham Six are typical examples. Had the death penalty not been removed in the UK all of them would now be dead. There is no way to justify the death penalty if even one innocent person has to take that long lonely walk to the gas chamber or even worse the electric chair.
I agree that there are some people whose crimes are so horrific that they should be executed, but by applying capital punishment in their cases you are exposing innocent people to the same penalty.
Please America ban capital punishment now and join the rest of civilised nations.
July 30th, 2008 at 6:02 pm
The problem with this case is that the visceral rage that is produced by the horrible murders of those little girls makes it near impossible for some people to objectively look at and discuss the treaty issue; an issue that was important enough to warrant the involvement of the Supreme Court of the United States, the International Court of Justice, and the executive branches of the US and Mexican federal governments.
In order to discuss these kinds of issues, people have to try to separate out the very legitimate emotional components from the intellectual/legal components. Without sounding to preachy about it, I think it would be interesting to hear how the non-emotional discussion plays out about how much weight treaties should be given and whether or not the Supremacy Clause should be interpreted as stricly as the 2nd ammendment was recently interpreted in the DC-gun-ban case.
This is my disclaimer for those folks that can’t have this discussion without wanting to discuss the many ways that Medellin should be made to suffer: He is a monster. He deserves no sympathy. Those little girls and their families deserve their pound of flesh.
Now, what do you think about strict constructionism and the way the conservative faction of the Supreme Court conventiently forgot to apply their favorite catch-phrase to the Supremacy Clause?
July 30th, 2008 at 6:08 pm
Look, this guy committed a henious crime in our country that deserves justice. Whether or not he’s a citizen is irrelvent. If an American commits a crime in a foreign country, shouldn’t they pay the price even if they are not citizens? Crime is crime all over the world, no matter who commits it. Those poor girls and their families deserve that much!
July 30th, 2008 at 10:46 pm
Like Manny had mentioned a treaty is a treaty. While this man deserves no pitty, the agreements that are set fourth must be followed otherwise other countries may also do the same with American Citizens in foreign countries and if so this country would have no right to complain since they are breaking the treaty with this particular execution.
July 31st, 2008 at 9:53 pm
i am Mexican and i read about terrible case of those teen girls, Please Mr. Medellin is Mexican Citizen just for convenience because he grow up in the USA and even he did not speak good spanish, he made a murder and rape and he has to pay for it, even the country or place in the world. If the American law is to be Executed sorry that´s the rule and have to be done. Don´t confuse he isn´t Mexican and he knew the Punishment for the murder and rape in USA he was n´t tourist or visitor, he used to live in Texas.
July 31st, 2008 at 10:55 pm
OK…let me make this easier to understand. NOBODY is suggesting that Medellin should not face the consequences of murdering those kids. Even if he would have received consular advice he would still have to answer for his crimes. Nobody doubts this.
The issue is whether the Texas government should have given him access to the Mexican consulate as is guaranteed by the Vienna treaty. The Vienna treaty exists so that if you and I were to ever be arrested in a foreign country (even if you hadn’t committed a crime)the authorities would be obligated to let us speak to a consular officer; someone that speaks your language and can give you some advice. Before someone trots out the old “if you’re arrested you must be bad” argument, remember that innocent tourists get arrested ALL the time in third world countries that ARE signatories to the treaty in question. I’m sure you WOULD want access to the U.S. consulate if you found yourself in a foreign jail. That’s the crux of this whole brouhahah – - Whether or not a treaty is to be observed or not.
August 1st, 2008 at 5:15 pm
He is a dirty Mexican who had no business being here in the first place. Is it August 5th yet?
August 1st, 2008 at 5:39 pm
Jose Medellin did a horrible, despicable crime, and I fully understand the reasons and rationale for him to face the death penalty.
But there is absolutely no reason to pull out racist sterotypes such as “he is a dirty mexican” to give legitimacy to your feelings and anger. From those two words, you seem to apply that his ethnicity is further proof of being capable of a despicable crime. Crime knows no color…and people of one race are no more prone to crime than another. And perhaps he had no “business being here in the first place”….but what age did he come to the U.S? Age three. His PARENTS are the ones who broke the laws about coming to this country.
That being said, I do support his death sentence. But lets not this case fuel further stereotypes and misconceptions about individuals of Mexican descent.
August 1st, 2008 at 6:01 pm
Wow, Sherry. Thanks for that nuanced pearl of wisdom. I would have hated this to be such a one-sided debate where only the non-bigots got to weigh in.
I guess every blog has its cretins. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Sherry.
By the way, someone remind Sherry the ethnicity/nationality for these guys:
Ted Bundy
Arthur Gary Bishop
Charles Manson
Jeffrey Dhamer
John Wayne Gacy
Coral Watts
Robert Lee Yates, Jr.
(hint – none of them were “dirty Mexicans”)
Lastly, WHERE IS BRIAN CUBAN? I thought he “moderated” the site to keep trolls like this from spewing garbage.
August 1st, 2008 at 8:30 pm
Only a few more days. It’s scum like this makes me want to drive from Houston to Huntsville wearing a smiley faced t-shirt. I hope there’s a special place for POS’s such as him.
August 2nd, 2008 at 9:56 pm
Just happened on to this site – my comments are all mine – this does not mean that anyone else in my family has the same feelings. Elizabeth Pena is my niece – she was a sweet and beautiful young lady who should have had many years ahead of her to marry, have children and then grandchildren, enjoy family life with a very large and wonderful extended family. We miss her every day – my sons and Elizabeth played together almost every day, we had all holidays together as a family and the damage that these heinous crimes have done to my family will never go away.
I don’t get to view the execution on Tuesday Aug 5th but I will be inside the prison as a support person for my family – my husband will be outside with a large group of family and friends. He viewed the Sean O’Brian execution and was amazed at how easily O’Brian just slipped away – Elizabeth and Jennifer certainly didn’t just “slip away”. All of my compassion in this case if for the victims and I don’t consider the families of these murderers to be victims.
Before you mount a soap box and declare to the world that Medellin deserves anything other than a swift death remember that this could have happened to your loved one!!!!!!!! I won’t even say a prayer for him – surely God won’t forgive these acts.
August 3rd, 2008 at 2:01 am
Patti,
I certainly feel for your loss and really empathize with you.
My personal belief is that criminals like this should simply be turned over to the victim’s family and permit the family to inflict punishment in any way that they see fit! The state can come by in a week or so to simply pick up the pieces.
August 3rd, 2008 at 10:49 pm
I don’t think he was forced to come to or stay in this country. Why should illegals have more rights than US citizens? He wasn’t a diplomat, just a vicious teenage criminal. I will agree that we should spare him when all the other illegals in this country leave on their own. What does the Geneva Convention say about 12 million of one countries citizens invading another THEN asking for special rights. Give me a break.
August 4th, 2008 at 4:12 pm
“Why should illegals have more rights than US citizens?”
This is the problem–A fundamental misunderstanding of the issue(s) being debated. The issue isn’t whether illegal aliens have more rights than US citizens under the Geneva Convention. The issue is also not whether Medellin gets the death penalty for is horrible crime. The issue is whether citizens of countries that signed the Vienna Convention (including U.S. citizens) have a right to speak with their consulate after their arrest.
To quote the summary above, there is “a bigger picture at stake. The picture frame encompasses the rights of United States citizens who may find themselves in similar situations in Mexico and other foreign nations.”
I have yet to see anyone on a soap box declaring that Medellin doesn’t deserve the punishment he got. Everyone empathizes with the family in this case. There are some of us, however, that are having a TOTALLY DIFFERENT CONVERSATION about the Vienna Convention and whether it applies in this or any other case.
I think Brian Cuban’s analysis of the issue is very enlightened : “What if Mexico was concurrently holding a Texas citizen under sentence of death? What if that citizen has been denied international treaty rights? Would Texas then be eager to execute Mr. Medellin? If Texas has no legal obligation to stop the execution, politics and public perception agendas are all that remain. At this time, Mexico appears to have nothing that Texas wants that would justify “mercy by agenda” Let us hope we have something that Mexico wants when the roles are reversed.”
Anybody want to answer those questions?
August 4th, 2008 at 4:22 pm
Don’t get me wrong, if anyone deserves to die it is this guy.
My issue is not with the Geneva convention itself. My issue is one I have for all death penalty cases and unfortunately did not address in my article. The Death penalty must not be applied in an arbitrary fashion. If there is any issue that left unresolved could lead to arbitrary application the penalty must not be inflicted until that issue is resolved. Since Texas is choosing to execute this person but then could honor the Vienna Convention for political or other reasons in a different case, there is an arbitrary factor here. The death penalty must be applied equally across the board.
August 4th, 2008 at 6:54 pm
Oh, how noble of Manny! In his righteous indignation (only because it’s a fellow Hispanic) he cries bigotry! Whatever. Cry to the racist bait/hate group LULAC why don’t you?
This scumbag needs the needle and he needed it long ago. Treaties be damned – kill him and rid the earth of the vermin who savagely raped and murdered two innocent, young ladies.
The Oprahization of American has turned a once vibrant country into one that panders to those who subscribe to feelings over logic, talks over action and political correctness over justice.
Would that I could be the one injecting the deadly syringe into his veins.
August 5th, 2008 at 1:38 am
#1. That’s about as moronic as if I were to say that you want him executed because you’re white and he’s not.
#2. Sherry’s comment was bigoted. If I were to do an experiment on bigotry I would use the following statement as my empirical control group: “He is a dirty Mexican who had no business being here in the first place”
#3. That dude is getting the needle tomorrow and he deserves it. I’ve been saying this all along.
#4. Nobody has answered the questions that our host, Brian Cuban, posited: “What if Mexico was concurrently holding a Texas citizen under sentence of death? What if that citizen has been denied international treaty rights? Would Texas then be eager to execute Mr. Medellin?”
#5. As for the LULAC bait, I’m not biting. Those people are whackos and have outlived their relevance.
#5. I challenge you to answer the questions with some substance as opposed to bumper sticker cliches.
August 5th, 2008 at 7:17 am
First comment..I am Mexican, and he should be dead since 10 years ago,, I had an ExGirlfriend who was raped by a crazy American in Cancun, She never could pass that traumatic episode in her live and still fighting against that,,,this is not a racist matter,, we all should be fair..and to be honest he deserves the upcoming future,, you will never know if something will happen to your sisters, mother, girlfriends, …
Very sorry Medellin you have to learn… even death.
marco.mtz.c@gmail.com
August 5th, 2008 at 7:48 am
Most are so full of hate as I read in these comments. The guy Jose Medellin is a raper/murderer. Such a crime is one of worst you can imagine. I feel very sorry for the parents and family of the two girls been killed. The murderer must be punished. Thats for sure. But there is another side on the medal. A crime what took place in 1994, 14 years ago. The same time he was sented to jail and deathrow. Living 14 years in such a place must be a complete punishment. I believe in justice, but I don’t believe in justice by taking somebody’s live. Murderes make murderers. If people can forgive at any time, all the people of the world become more human and there will be less violence. What drives a guy from 17/18 years old to rape and kill? Booze, drugs, pills etc. Stuff he can become from other people on the street? Stop the deathpenalty now! Believe in yourself and learn from eachother how to live in peace. Man what a world!
August 5th, 2008 at 8:05 am
Patti Zapalac,,
I am not a religious person ,,, but believe me when I said that I have all my mind and heart with you and your family,,
Christianne,
Really hard comments from you,, but I guess you feel deeply this case, I liked your post.
To the other guys,,
Please forget law and treaties. Philosophy can reach more….
August 5th, 2008 at 8:13 am
He killed therefore he deserves to die as does Ian Huntley here in Britain who also murdered 2 little girls………… sure the Birmingham 6 were innocent as were the Guildford 4 but Sean Bracken this is a case of RAPE and MURDER they were charged allbeit wrongly of terrorist offences……….. i for one think Britain should reinstate the Death Penalty perhaps it wwould make people like Hntly and Rose west think twice before they RAPE and TORTURE there victims
August 5th, 2008 at 2:05 pm
I have run a Death row ministry in Texas for years. I was opposed to the death penalty, until I met Jose. I have met him face to face, as well as exchanged letters. He has not ever shown any remorse. He has bragged about the crime. He proudly cofessed. there is no question of his guilt. I hear all this crap about the treaty. He did not contact the Mexican Government. This is the State of Texas, not Mexico. Did those poor girls get to contact anyone?? Can You imagine what those girls went through? How about what their parents and families have gone through? He should not have come into our state and murdered these two INNOCENT girls ad he would not be in this situation. Leathal injection is a lot kinder than what I would like to see happen to him. If it were up to me, I’d like him in a room with the two fathers of these girls. All these bleeding hearts……… What if these two girls were you daughters? Sisters? Mothers?
August 5th, 2008 at 6:27 pm
To Sean Bracken :
You are a sick man for thinking this man should be spared! He has no right to live whatso ever at all. I wish they would kill him slowley and revive him multiple times to make him suffer over and over untill the people doing get bored with it. I guess you support what he has done. You don’t feel he should be punished for what he has done. Imagine if it was you daughter. But by the way you speak you have no children. may God help you, and you sick mind of appeasment for rapist and murderers of children.
August 5th, 2008 at 9:30 pm
Where were all you bleeding heart, left wing, liberal sheep when Sean O’Brien was waiting to be executed? He took part in the crime, too. I don’t recall an uproar at that time. Oh, I get it. It’s that Medellin is an illegal alien from Mexico and we have to treat him extra special? The dumb American who was executed in record time isn’t afforded the rights Medellin was given. Funny how you find it so easy to talk out of both sides of your mouth.
Strap Medellin to the gurney and send him on his way to hell where he belongs. But that’s just too unbelievably easy compared to what he did to Elizabeth and Jennifer.
It’s just about 4:25 CST by my clock. Come on 5:30.
August 5th, 2008 at 11:14 pm
Sherry, whether the guy is Mexican or American, you don’t need to call him dirty. His actions are what make him dirty. He will get his just due and that’s what this is all about. The World Court has no sovereignty over the U.S.. The Treaty is just that, a treaty, an agreement about our citizens. However, commit murder and I don’t care who you are, whether he’s American or Mexican, justice needs to be served and THAT is civilized and that is why there is order in the world. People who think this execution is barbaric have it backwards. The barbarism is letting this man walk away from murdering and raping some teenagers. The reason this world has not imploded yet is because there is still fear of the consequences of wrong-doing. If the U.S. didn’t enforce, there would be no enforcement and the people who are okay with murder would probably not like living in a lawless world.
Thank goodness our country and our state still bring common sense and justice to this chaotic (and yes uncivilized) world.
August 5th, 2008 at 11:20 pm
Read the bold print…..DONT MESS WITH TEXAS!!!! Bye Bye Jose Satan is waiting !!!
August 5th, 2008 at 11:29 pm
As regarding the question: what to do when a citizen of Texas is charged with a crime in Mexico, I’ll answer it thus: I believe that any American citizen that commits murder abroad should be treated no differently from Medellin. However, if it becomes clear that the American was convicted on the basis of a false witness or insufficient evidence or is blatantly denied due process, or is accused of a crime that is ridiculous (innocently naming a teddy bear Muhammed for example), and diplomacy fails; in that case it would be the duty of our government to send a strike team into that country to effect our citizen’s rescue. But some will say that that is an act of war on a soveriegn country. That is true; but it is an open secret that throughout the last decade elements of the Mexican Army have made many incursions across our southern border to act as security for drug smugglers. In effect, Mexico has been conducting clandestine military operations against the US for years. So why shouldn’t we invade Mexico? In my view, President Bush sent the troops to the wrong theater of war.
Regarding all those comments to the effect that the death penalty should be abolished: My view is that the giving or witholding of mercy/forgiveness is, and should be, the prerogative of the victims’ loved ones and none else. Let the offended party decide what to do with the offender.
August 5th, 2008 at 11:29 pm
One more thing… for those who would say what if this was one of our citizens in another country who was convicted of murdering an raping a teenager in that country. I have this to say to you, I would have no problem with them being tried without our consulate intervening as long as the guy was given a fair trial. I would have no problem with them executing him (after giving him 15 freaking years to appeal). It’s clear that he is guilty, but the reason Mexico is upset is because they wanted to get him off. They wanted to bring him to Mexico, but fortunately Texas didn’t allow that to happen. The man got a fair trial and he is guilty, the end.
August 6th, 2008 at 3:02 am
The State of Texas is not violating any treating by executing this dirt bag. He never asked to speak to the Mexican Consular until 4 years after the murder.
Also I find it curious that news reports flash his disgusting grill all over the place but refuse to show any photos of the victims.
If George Bush is the best that America can do, then we are toast. This is also not the first time he has sided with the World Court against American citizens. Not very Pro-American if you ask me.
August 6th, 2008 at 3:55 am
tick tock. may you burn in hell jose, you monstrous piece of shit.
August 6th, 2008 at 4:20 am
I knew Elizabeth. I know her family well. The Pena and Ertman families have been tortured by the horrible actions that Jose admitted to and even bragged about. He never denied what he had done. There was no hidden DNA that was witheld that could have proven him innocent. There has never been any question of his guilt. No one forced him to do this horrible crime. He had a choice to do this but he chose a path that has caused horrible pain to many people including his own familiy.
If we are to remain a free country, we must uphold the laws of our country. Jose was convicted in a court of law. His conviction has been appealed and reviewed and reviewed and upheld in each review. The death penalty is the ultimate punishment. It is certainly not a punishment that can handed out lightly. It should be reserved for only the worst crimes. The crimes of Peter Cantu, Jose Medellin, Derrick Sean O’Brian, and the rest of the Black and White Gang were judged by a jury to be so bad that the death penalty was how they should be punished. This was not a sentence handed down by a Judge. It was handed down by a jury selected by both the defense and prosecution teams. This was all done in accordance with the laws of the State of Texas.
By the time I am writing this, Jose is already dead. His sentence has been carried out. The laws of our land have been carried out. If we are going to attempt to remain a lawful society, we must carry out punishment for crimes committed by people who chose to break the laws. Jose paid the ultimate price for a terrible choice he made one day. But never forget, two pretty girls whose lives were cut short. They were repeatedly gang raped and sodomized, beaten, strangled, then beaten some more just to make sure they were dead. Jose’s actions caused his death.
August 6th, 2008 at 4:34 am
I am very happy that piece of sh..t is dead. I do belive it is ironic that the only time mexicans want to go home, is when they are caught by the LAW. I just wish I could piss on his grave..
August 6th, 2008 at 4:42 am
I believe that he made a mistake and Jan you are right no one should be killed and people should start going to church and really listen to gods word. God is the only one to give trial when we no longer excist and people i have a daughter and I think that what he did was not fair to the girls or their parents. But like Jan said they were probably drunk and had done drugs. What happens to all those drug dealers making the millions and causing this types of crimes to be commited. They get to live like movie stars. First everyone writing should get in peace with themselves and pray that god forgive them for making these comment. We are no one to take a life. So if he was involved in it he sined and therefore we cannot sin by taking his life. The girls will never come back.
STOP THE DEATH PENALTY……….. GOD
August 6th, 2008 at 4:45 am
Remember God is in control. Mr. Medellin will have his trial with the lord. Making comments like the ones here is sad. GOd please help everyone.
12-12-12
August 6th, 2008 at 4:55 am
These so called mexican-americans want to come to our nation but don’t want to live by our laws. All the illegals are trashing our society. We are the ones that pay for it. It doesnt affect them. They get the free insurance at our cost. They want to live in America but as soon as something goes bad, they are crying for Mexico. I guess this turned into a trashing of all the illegal Mexicans in our country. Treaty or no treaty, live by our rules! The Mexican government is the most corrupt around. I had a friend stay in jail in Mexico for 6 days over a shotgun shell left in a jeep he was pulling back from a hunting trip. Never seen the jeep again. They have no laws. All we do is cater to everybody else. Screw everybody else. Stay out of our country!
August 6th, 2008 at 4:58 am
To Manny Paleaz: Great set of comments sir, it was really a pleasure reading your analysis. Manny is right in stating that it is near impossible to look at the treaty/legal side of this when such a heinous crime has been comitted. I myself do not care for the vienna treaty in this case, a man who comitted a crime like this deserves to die, slowly and in pain. But that is my opinion, in another case which was less emotionally charged, it would be possible to have a reasonable discussion on treaties and international relations, but for today, all we can have is two sides, one that gets angry and is in favour of the death of Mr. Medellín. And the select few on other side who can emotionally detach themselves from the horror of this crime and discuss international relations.
August 6th, 2008 at 4:07 pm
“What if Mexico was concurrently holding a Texas citizen under sentence of death? What if that citizen has been denied international treaty rights? Would Texas then be eager to execute Mr. Medellin?”
I’ll take a crack at it. First of all, please correct me if I’m wrong, but it’s my understanding that Mexico does not have a death penalty. Well, formally anyway. It is also my understanding that for years there have been Americans “arrested” in Mexico who have been denied any rights, much less international, that is unless they can cough up enough dinero to buy their rights. It’s kind of a common occurrence to be shook down by the Mexican police (i.e., “You ran a stop sign, give me 200 pesos and I’ll let you go” true story btw) and in my view the Mexican government sure doesn’t do a whole lot to stop it. Mexico itself has not always played by the rules when it comes to arresting and detaining American citizens.
But let’s just say, theoretically, that American citizen “John Doe” entered Mexico as a child and grew to adulthood there. At age 18 he rapes and murders two young teenage girls. He fully confesses upon his arrest and does not ask for his treaty rights until years after the fact. He would dearly love to be extradited back to the US where there is (theoretically) no DP. I cannot imagine in a million years that our country would even WANT him back. As far as I’m concerned, Mexico could keep John Doe and pretty much have their way with him. We’re not talking about someone whose rights to due process were violated. They were trying to slither through a narrow legal loophole in order to help Jose avoid punishment. Where is the justice in that? Do you really think that American taxpayers should have to subsidize attempt after attempt for this guy to avoid a death much more humane that what he allowed those two girls? It IS a passionate issue because you’re talking about illegal immigrants, you’re talking about rape and murder, and you’re talking about Texas for crying out loud. I for one am very glad we did not bow down to international pressure on this one. If there was any question of his guilt, then I would applaud his lawyer’s efforts in trying to stave off his death sentence but in this case, it was long past time for justice to be served.
August 6th, 2008 at 4:28 pm
The real sticking point here that everyone seems to be missing is that he was in the United States illegally. If you are caught and arressted in Mexico for a crime and they find you are there illegally, there are automatic jail penalties. You do not get to call your consulate, you do not get to call your lawyer, you do not even get to call mommmy. In Mexico if you are there illegally you go straight to jail, then compound that with a crime and it will be a cold day in hell before you breathe free air again.
August 6th, 2008 at 6:18 pm
GOD BLESS TEXAS! I hate Texan’s arogance, can’t stand the Cowboy’s and wish I could have served my country somewhere besides El Paso, but I’m behind them all the way on the death penalty. In fact they make me proud. I may just move there and run for Govener. Only my policy would be your (overwhelmingly) convicted by a jury of your peer’s, you get two year’s to present any new evidance, then two years +1day your DEAD! Save taxpayer’s millions, but what do I know. This scum deserves to die, like so many others. They didn’t inquire as to thier victoms nationality before thier horrible death’s, why should I care about his. I can’t waite to read his last words on the TDOC website, funny how all these people find God at the end. Good riddance you sorry piece of trash, may many more follow you.
August 6th, 2008 at 6:28 pm
I do not know the answer to this but her is my question:
Let us take the emotion out of it. Could Texas have agreed to the International Court Review and if they did not agree with the finding executed Medellin anyways? If they are not legally required to submit to the review then it would follow that they are not bound by any finding. It would only be advisory. If the International Court found no prejudice they would agree to allow the execution to proceed regardless. The International community is satisfied, Medellin is still dead. No harm. No foul on that issue.
August 6th, 2008 at 10:24 pm
Mr. Cuban, you hit the nail on the head. Following the letter of the law in this case would have resulted in an execution nonetheless, BUT our treaty rights for U.S. citizens would have remained intact. The reason the Bush administration and so many international law observers think that Texas was being too hasty in exercising its right to punish Medellin is that now the door is wide open for abuse by other countries.
Judging from some of the comments above, it looks as if there is still a fundamental misunderstanding about what the treaty requires. It is pretty simple. If a foreign national is arrested he/she MUST be told about their right to contact their consulate. That’s it. We don’t have to do anything else. Just give them a phone call. No delay in process. No delay in justice. No free pass to avoid the death penalty. Just a phone call.
Just because the murders of these little girls is horrendous does not mean that scrapping the constitution or 200+ years of Supreme Court precedence is a good idea. I’m going to quote from Justic Bryer’s opinion in this case:
“The majority’s two holdings taken together produce practical anomalies. They unnecessarily complicate the President’s foreign affairs tasks…for example…worsening relations with our neighbou Mexico [and] precipitating actions by other nations putting at risk American citizens who have the misfortune of being arrested while traveling abroad, or of diminishing or Nations reputation abroad as a result of our failure to follow the “rule of law” principles that we preach. In sum, a strong line of precedent, likely reflecting the view of the Founder, indicates that the treaty provisions before…[is] self executing. In reaching a contrary conclusion, the Court has failed to take proper account of that precedent and, as a result, the Nation may well break its word even though the President seeks to live up to that word and Congress has done nothing to suggest the contrary.”
We preach the “rule of law”, but we conveniently forgot it in this case and, as a result, have weakened our ability to request that it be followed beyond our borders.
OK. This is the part where everyone starts yelling, “but that guys is a monster and he deserves to die…” Apples and oranges my friends. Apples and oranges.
August 7th, 2008 at 3:59 am
It is being suggested that the state of Texas was too hasty in executing this man. The crime was committed 15 years ago. This case has had numerous appeals, reviews, and delays. One of the girls he killed was 14 years old. The time span between the crime and his execution was longer than the life he ended! Think about that. Good grief how can anyone call this hasty?
Many tricks were attempted to delay his execution, including this attempt, but fortunately the rule of law was upheld. That was all this was, just a trick, a technicality to try to trip up the system. A person must obey the laws of the land he walks in. He must be held accountable to the land he is in. What happened to basic right and wrong? He committed a crime. He paid the price. If you don’t like the penalties of the land you walk in, you have two choices. One is to go elsewhere. Go to a more favorable land. The second is to work to change the laws you dislike.
What I fail to understand is why is so much effort put into the defense of people who have show nothing good to society. Why is so much sympathy and labor poured out for a person who raped and killed a person? What is society to gain for this? How does trying to save the life of a person who bragged of his horrible crime a good thing? Isn’t there more we can with ourselves? A man who does such horrible crimes is not worthy of your efforts.
Randy Ertman made a point about the mess in Mexico. The crime, the drugs, etc. Although he tends to be a little rough around the edges, I have found him to have a heart of gold. He really has a good point there. Something should be done about that mess down there.
Perhaps the intellect shown by some of these posters on this board could help solve some of societys problems. Who knows, you might save both the life of a future killer and his victim. You could save two lives. Try to turn around the life of a person before they make the awlful decision to rape and kill a person. Change the life of a child before he goes bad instead of all this debating the fine details of a treaty that was never meant to be utilized to save the sorry life of a horrible mean person who was undeserving of your efforts.
August 7th, 2008 at 2:58 pm
I also agree that this idea of it being too hasty of an execution after 15 years is preposterous. Also that he considers himself a Mexican national is silly because he came here at the Age of 3 and was here for 15 years attending out schools and grew up here.
August 7th, 2008 at 3:09 pm
DL: You misunderstand me. I am not arguing that he should not have been executed. In fact, I believe the opposite. He deserves no sympathy and should have been punished with with an iron fist.
The point I’ve making is that the Supremacy Clause of the constitution is VERY important and should be preserved for the sake of our citizens that find themselves in trouble abroad – -especially our citizens that might not enjoy due process in countries with less than fair judicial penal systems.
“Technicality” is a word that is cavalierly tossed around, but we’re not talking about a technicality. We’re talking about a well established line out of one of our most sacred documents – The Constitution. Specifically it says, “This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States …and all Treaties made…shall be the supreme Law of the land…every State shall be bound…”. The guys that signed our Constitution took this very seriously because they believed in the rule of law. If they were alive today they would probably agree that (1) Medellin deserved the harshest punishment and, (2) that it should have been carried out in accordance with the treaty. He’d be as dead as he is today, but our ability to demand that treaties be observed by other countries would remain intact.
There are two other of your comments with which I take issue. The first is “If you don’t like the penalties of the land you walk in, you have two choices. One is to go elsewhere. Go to a more favorable land. The second is to work to change the laws you dislike.” There is no law in this instance that I dislike. Second, the penalties of the land are totally appropriate. Third, the U.S. is one of the few countries that CAN be called favorable when it comes to due process and respect for the rule of law. The problem is that a simple provision of a treaty wasn’t followed…a provision that is applicable in any other land to which you invite me to go.
The second comment that I think deserves some examination is, What I fail to understand is why is so much effort put into the defense of people who have show nothing good to society. Why is so much sympathy and labor poured out for a person who raped and killed a person?” The reason that so much effort and labour is put in to defending bad people is that in many instances, bad peoples’ cases help shape constitutional boundaries. There are plenty of cases on the books that have helped enshrine important rights that you enjoy that have their genesis in crimes committed by murderers, rapists, and thieves. This really isn’t a case about Medellin. It’s a case about treaty rights that may or may not apply to our citizens and whether the Constitution should be interpreted strictly or whether we should find “technicalities” to avoid its mandates.
Lastly, the only people in this case that were looking out for Medeliin’s interests were his lawyers. The rest of us that are pointing out the simple to understand words in our Constitution are looking at a much bigger picture: What happens when the rule of law is ignored by Texas courts? if China, or Zimbabwe, or Colombia, or Mexico see that we go back on our word what is to keep them from keeping their’s? If treaties don’t supersede state laws then why follow any other Constitutional provisions? (gun laws, voting rights, right to counsel, property rights, the right to make a profit, etc.)
Again, just so that you keep my arguments straight, Medellin deserved what he got. The problem is that in our haste to carry out the punishment we forgot to honor a treaty. He would have been executed EVEN IF he had been given the right to speak to his consulate. The questions nobody seems to be able to answer is: Why is the state of Texas reluctant to let prisoners speak to their consulate? What are we afraid of? Do we have such little faith in our own justice system that we are unwilling to say the following words after their arrest: ” You have a right to an attorney. You have a right to remain silent. Anything you say may be used against you in a court of law. If you are a foreign citizen you have a right to speak to your consulate.”?
August 8th, 2008 at 3:32 am
Perhaps if this issue were not raised at the 11th hour before a horrible human being were to be justly executed, some of us would understand the rationale for this better. Perhaps if this issue were raised for someone who committed a “vitimless crime” there would be more sympathy for this process.
If we allow a treaty with other countries to come before maintaining a decent society, it would seem that we have given away control of our country to persons that have no real interest in our society.
Despite his being a illegal alien in our country, he was afforded a trial equal to that of a United States citizen. If he could not afford an attorney, one was appointed for him. I am fairly sure that one was. At taxpayer expense too. He was not treated unfairly in that regard. He was cheated of nothing. His trial and appeals, and everything else was just as fair as that of his co-defendants. I cannot see this consulate issue as anything more than an arguement utilized to delay and obstruct his execution. This is not a new tactic, just a new arguement. Probably one of the better and well though out ones I can recall, but a tactic to stall an execution regardless. This is nothing new for the anti death penalty crowd. That is all this is. He was just a pawn in this game. There is no world wide moral outrage. There is no outcry for Jose. No, the world sees this as a man who caused his own demise. this was nothing more than a sceme by persons who for some reason oppose execution.
I knew one of these children. I know her siblings, her parents, her aunt, her uncle, her cousins, and so on. I will forever remember the days her mother spent frantic look for her missing daughter. I will forever remember the day we all found out that two bodies were found by the railroad tracks and it may be the girls. I will never forget the hour we all found out that it was my freinds daughter. I will never forget that funderal that i attended. I will never forget the horrible pain her mother and father and other family members went through viewing the disgusting evidence and testimony during the trial.
August 8th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
“Perhaps if this issue were raised for someone who committed a “vitimless crime” there would be more sympathy for this process.”
I completely agree with you.
August 9th, 2008 at 3:08 am
I meant victimless but I suppose you got the point.
January 11th, 2009 at 12:15 pm
Maybe if he wasnt in the country illegally he would not have brutally raped and murdered two young girls then joked about it. I would expect nothing else of a "dyed in the wool democrat". Liberals always side with the murders and child molesters. Forget the rights of the victim. Lets worry about the trash and scum who brutalize and kill. The monster deserved what he got and it should have come alot sooner. I hope he was scared out of his mind. I hope he suffered horrible agony. He deserved far more than he got or gave.